As I am slowly getting back to reactivating my Deckel NC stuff after 10 years of neglect (time flies!!!) I immediately ran into an error code I could not explain. As all my print outs are burried in boxes and most of my digital memeory was stolen about 6 years ago (4 laptops, welcome to Brussels), I dug up the remnants of my old website.
So this is a copy and paste from there, fuguring it might help others too.



Below you can find an error code listing for the Dialog 2/3/4 and Contour 1/2/3 controls.

This includes an explanation of what the errors mean and how they can be fixed.

Each manual included with a machine has such a listing, but the trick with the listing below is that it combines the listings for all machines and for the latest SW versions (but it is still not totally complete). It must recognized that for example the owner of a 1985 machine would only have his codes for that year. Usually machines were updated in SW, which resulted in new error codes. Normally each new SW version included new codes. Also, as time progressed, new codes were incorporated and published in the tech bulletins. This leads to the situation that often a user will get an error code unknown to him and not documented in his outdated manuals.

The below lists should fix this to 98%.
The list also includes some very interesting tips I have never seen anywhere else, but it does not include all Technical Bulletin information
Note on Dialog 11: The Dialog 11 was much better documented. It had a separate error code book with detailed failure correction suggestions (down to the identification of individual EPROMs). It also had a lot more LEDs to identify a machine status and it had a disply to actually disply status information. The Dialog 11 failure mode analysis would exceed the reasonable volume of this website.


FEHLER- UND HINWEISANZEIGEN
===========================
Fehler- und Hinweisanzeigen aus dem CNC-Bereich.
------------------------------------------------
Fehler 00 Die Spannung der CNC-Steuerueg ist/
war unter 18V gesunken; die CNC wurde
erscheint neben ordnugsgemaess abgeschaltet, Informatio-
der Betriebsartenanzeige nen sind gespeichert (gerettet) worden.
Abhilfemassnahme Steuerung erneut einschalten. Sollte
dies nicht moeglich sein, so muss die
Spannungsversorgung der CNC- und SPS-
Steuerung ueberprueft werden. Hierzu
"Elektrische Unterlagen" zu Hilfe neh-
men.
* Fehler 01 Die Spannung der CNC-Steuerung ist/
* war unter 18V gesunken, die CNC wurde
* erscheint neben nicht ordnungsgemaess abgeschaltet.
* der Betriebsarteanzeige Wurde zuvor das NC-Programm in der Be-
* triebsart 8 oder 9 abgearbeitet, so
* ist zu kontrollieren ob das Programm
* noch vollstaendig gespeichert ist (insb.
* der NC-Satz der gerade abgearbeitet
* worden ist).
*
* Abhilfemassnahme Steuerung erneut einschalten.
* 1. Sollte das nicht moeglich sein, so
* muss die Spannungsversorgung ueberprueft
* werden (wie bei Fehler 00).
* 2. Eventuell Speicherbaugruppe NSP55
* in der CNC auswechseln.
*
Fehler 01 Programmspeicher-Pufferung (Akku, NSV56
NSP55) defekt oder bei 2xNSP55, eine
Karte fehlt oder defekt.
Abhilfemassnahme Fehlende oder defekte Baugruppe ein-
stecken bzw. tauschen.
*
*
*
Fehler 02 Die Spannung der SPS-Steuerung ist/
war unter 18V gesunken, die SPS wurde
ordnungsgemaess abgeschaltet.
Abhilfemassnahmen Steuerung erneut einschalten.
Eventuell Spannungsversorgung der SPS-
Steuerung ueberpruefen.(wie bei Fehler 00)
Fehler 03 Programmspeicher initialisieren.
(jungfraeuliche oder defekte NSP55)
Fehler 08 Lageregelung X-Achse
09 Lageregelung Y-Achse
10 Lageregelung Z-Achse
11 Lageregelung C-Achse
Fehlererkennung Zu grosse Ablage (Differenz Soll - zu
Istwert). Abweichung groesser 32Å laenger
als 120ms bei Lageregelung (Stillstand
der Achsen) oder beim Anfahren der Po-
sition.
Fehlerauswertung Not-Aus-Abschaltung.
Ursache 1. Verdruecken der Achse durch aeussere
Kraefte.
2. Zu starkes Klemmen in den Fuehrungen,
Schwergaengigkeit.
3. Messsystem defekt, Glasmassstab bzw.
Kabelbruch.
4. Antriebsverstaerker
Driftfehler, falscher Geschwindig-
keitsabgleich, falsche Reglerbe-
schaltung. Reglerbaugruppe ver-
tauscht?
5. Motor dreht nicht.
Tacho verschmutzt bzw. defekt.
6. NRP - Drift falsch abgeglichen,
Baugruppe defekt.
Fehler 12 - Bahnfehler X-Achse
13 - Bahnfehler Y-Achse
14 - Bahnfehler Z-Achse
15 - Bahnfehler C-Achse
Fehlererkennung 1. Ablage (Differenz Soll - zu Istwert)
160Å laenger als 150ms waehrend einer
interpolierenden Bewegung in G01,
G02 oder G03 , wenn Genauhalt (G61)
wirksam ist.
2. Schleppabstand groesser 8mm fuer laen-
ger 300ms wenn G64 wirksam ist.
Wirksam in Betriebsart 7, 8, 9
Fehlerauswertung Not-Aus-Abschaltung.
Ursache 1. Verdrueckung durch aeussere Kraefte.
2. Schwergaengigkeit, z.B. Keilleiste
zu stramm eingestellt.
3. Messsystem defekt.
Glasmassstab bzw. Kabelbruch.
4. Antriebsverstaerker
Driftfehler, falsch Reglerbeschal-
tung, falscher Geschwindigkeitsab-
gleich. Reglerbaugruppe vertauscht?
5. Motor dreht nicht.
Tacho verschmutzt bzw. defekt.
6. NRP - Baugruppe defekt.
Fehler 16 - Geschwindigkeitsfehler X-Achse
17 - Geschwindigkeitsfehler Y-Achse
18 - Geschwindigkeitsfehler Z-Achse
19 - Geschwindigkeitsfehler C-Achse
Fehlererkennung Abweichung groesser als 200% der Soll-
wertgeschwindigkeit fuer mehr als 600ms.
Bei Eilgang in allen Betriebsarten und
bei Vorschubgeschwindigkeit in BA 5
und 6.
Fehlerauswertung Not-Aus-Abschaltung.
Ursache 1. Verdrueckung durch aeussere Kraefte.
2. Zu starkes Klemmen in den Fuehrungen,
Schwergaengigkeit.
3. Messsystem defekt, Glasmassstab, Ka-
belbruch.
4. Antriebsverstaerker, Driftfehler,
Geschwindigkeitsabgleich falsch,
falsche Reglerbeschaltung. Regler-
baugruppe vertauscht?
5. Motor dreht nicht, Tacho verschmutzt
bzw. defekt.
6. NRP - Baugruppe defekt.
Fehler 20 Gesamt-Checksumfehler der EPROM's auf
NPP55.
Fehlerursache EPROM's defekt, oder falsch gesteckt.
Baugruppe NPP55 defekt.
Abhilfemassnahme Baugruppe oder EPROM's wechseln (Ein-
baurichtung beachten).
Fehler 21 - dto. jedoch bei NPP54
23 - NRP
24 - NZP /X
25 - NZP /Y
26 - NZP /Z
27 - NZP /C
28 - NPP90 / SPS-System EPROM / F,E
29 - NPP90 / SPS-Anwender EPROM's / A, B, C, D
* Fehler 30 Fehler auf der Speicherbaugruppe NSP55
*
* Fehlerursache Fehlerhafte RAM-Pruefung nach Einschal-
* ten des Hauptschalters bzw. bei Ein/
* Auslesen des NC-Programms.
*
* Fehlerauswertung Not-Aus-Abschaltung.
*
* Abhilfemassnahme Baugruppe NSP55 auswechseln.
* Wenn Fehler immer noch vorhanden, dann
* Baugruppe NPP55 auswechseln.
*
* Fehler 31 Softwarefehler auf NPP54
*
* Abhilfemassnahme Baugruppe tauschen.
Fehler 30 BA 1 bis BA 15 Programmspeicher-Fehler
Abhilfemassnahme 1. In BA 14 alte Werkstueckprogramme
auf Datentraeger sichern.
2. Steuerung ausschalten.
3. Neues Software-Paket komplett tau-
schen.
4. Noch im ausgeschalteten Zustand die
BA16 anwaehlen.
5. Steuerung einschalten.
6. Mit der LOeSCH-Taste und der UeBER-
NAHME-Taste die Speicherinitialisie-
rung aktivieren.
7. Bei fehlerfreier Speicherinitiali-
sierung erscheint nach einigen Se-
kunden die normale BA16 Darstellung.
Laesst sich der Speicher nicht initia-
lisieren, erscheint eine entsprech-
ende Meldung auf dem Bildschirm.
Fehler 31 Programmspeicher initialisieren.
(keine Software-Vertraeglichkeit)
!! Achtung !! Speicher wird kpl. ge-
loescht.
Abhilfemassnahme Software-Tausch . Siehe Abhilfemassnahme
von Fehler 30


Fehler 32 Softwarefehler auf NRP
Abhilfemassnahme Baugruppe tauschen.
Fehler 33 Messkreisfehler auf NZP /X
Fehlerursache Baugruppe nicht vorhanden, Messkreiska-
kabel nicht eingesteckt oder defekt,
NRP - Baugruppe fehlt oder defekt.

Abhilfemassnahme NZP - Baugruppe auswechseln oder Mess-
kreiskabel ueberpruefen und einstecken.
ggf. NRP - Baugruppe tauschen.
Fehler 34 - dto. jedoch fuer Y
35 - Z
36 - C
Fehler 37 Aufgerufene Achse fehlt.
Abhilfemassnahme Programm ueberpruefen und korrigieren.
Fehler 38 Softwarefehler in der SPS-Steuerung.
Abhilfemassnahme Hauptschalter aus-einschalten.
wenn Fehler immer noch vorhanden, dann
NPP90 in SPS-Steuerung auswechseln.
Fehler 39 Hardwarefehler in der SPS-Steuerung.
Abhilfemassnahme NPP90-Baugruppe auswechseln.
Fehler 40 Irgend eine NEA80 ist defekt.(SPS-PC1)
Fehler 41 SPS-Steuerung
1. NEA90-Ausgabebaugruppe X50/51 fehlt
(nicht eingesteckt), defekt oder
24V - Stromzufuehrung fehlt (gelbe
LED leuchtet nicht).
Fehler 42 - dto. 2.NEA90-Ausgabegruppe X52/53
43 - dto. 3. X54/55
*44 - dto. 4. X56/57
45 - dto. 5. X58/59
46 - dto. 6. X60/61
* bzw. NDA90 bei FP5-6-7NC.
Fehler 47 1. NE90-Eingabebaugruppe X70/71/72/73
fehlt (nicht eingesteckt) oder de-
fekt.
Fehler 48 - dto. 2.NE90-Eingabebaugruppe X74/75/76/77 fehlt
49 - dto. 3. X78/79/80/81
50 - dto. 4. X82/83/84/85
51 - dto. 5. X86/87/88/89
Fehler 60 Fraeskopfumschalter (wagerecht-senkr.)
auserhalb des Werkzeugwechsel-Zyklus
umgeschaltet.
Fehlerauswertung Werkzeugwechsel-Aufruf wird gesperrt.
Abhilfemassnahme Fraeskopfumschalter in die Ausgangs-
stellung zurueck schalten (derzeitige
Arbeitsspindel). Reihenfolge der Be-
dienung einhalten. Siehe "WZ-Wechsel"
im Bedienerhandbuch.
Fehler 61 Werkzeugwechsel-Aufruf bzw. -Quittie-
rung gesperrt.
Ursache 1. Spindel dreht, Achse(n) verfahren.
2. Spindelbremse ist geoeffnet.
3. Schwenkschalter an der Handsteuer-
leiste ist in Stellung "Werkzeug
entspannen".
Abhilfemassnahme In Betriebsart 1, 4, 5, 6, 7
zu 1.) Vorschub und Drehzahl ausschal.
zu 2.) Spindelbremse schliessen.
zu 3.) Schwenkschalter in Grundstel-
lung "Spannen" bringen.
Fehler 62 M06(66, 67)-Aufruf ohne T-Nummer.
WZ-Aufruf bei Maschinen mit autom.
WZ-Wechsler.
Abhilfemassnahme Der M-Fkt. muss eine T-Nummer folgen.
In Betriebsart 11 korrigieren z.B.
M06 T11.
Fehler 65 Maschinentyp fehlt.
Abhilfemassnahme Schalterstellung S1.1 , S1.2 , S1.3
auf NPP90 Baugruppe (SPS-Steuerung)
ueberpruefen. Hierzu Einstellwerte auf
Zeichnung in Spalte 3 der Mappe "Elek-
trische Unterlagen" zu Hilfe nehmen.
Fehler 68 Ungueltiges Datenwort (S) bei "Senden",
verursacht von SPS-Steuerung.
Abhilfemassnahme NPP90-Baugruppe in SPS-Steuerung wech-
seln.
Fehler 69 Ungueltiges Datenwort (P) bei "Senden",
verursacht von CNC-Steuerung.
Abhilfemassnahme NPP54-Baugruppe in CNC-Steuerung wech-
seln.
Fehler 70 NC-Programmspeicher ist leer. Nur
Hinweisanzeige, generiert beim Ein-
schalten.
Fehler 71 Programmspeicher ist voll (256kB bzw.
512kB sind belegt).
Auswirkung in Die weitere Eingabe wird gesperrt. Die
Betriebsart 11 vorhandenen Programme bleiben im Spei-
cher erhalten.
Abhilfemassnahme Betriebsart kurz verlassen und wieder
anwaehlen. Programm optimieren und ab-
schliessen.


Auswirkung in Beim Einlesen von ext. Datenspeicher
Betriebsart 13/15 (Kassette, Lochstreifen, Diskette) wird
bei Erreichen der max. Speicherkapa-
zitaet die Datenaufnahme gestoppt. Das
bereits eingelesene Programm wird ge-
loescht.
Abhilfemassnahme 1. Das Programm nochmals einlesen und
kurz vor Erreichen der Speicher-
grenze das Einlesen stoppen. Pro-
gramm in Betriebsart 11 abschlies-
sen, nur wenn sinnvoll.
2. Programm am externen Programmier-
platz (z.B. DIAPROG) so optimieren,
dass 256kB bzw. 512kB nicht ueber-
schritten werden.
Anmerkungen In die Gesamtspeicherkapazitaet von
256KB bzw. 512kB gehen Werkzeugkorrek-
turspeicher und NC-Programmspeicher
incl. Unterprogrammspeicher ein.
Fehler 72 Aufgerufener Korrekturwert (D) fehlt.
Abhilfemassnahme In der Betriebsart 10 der betreffen-
den Korrekturnummer einen Wert zuwei-
sen.
Fehler 73 Fehler im NC-Programm.
Programm kann nicht abgearbeitet wer-
den, da ein notwendiger Hauptsatz
fehlt; kein Spindel- oder Vorschub-
wert.
Abhilfemassnahme Satznummer notieren bzw. merken. Satz-
nummer des zuletzt bearbeiteten Satzes
merken.
In Betriebsart 11 fehlerhaften Satz
anwaehlen. Fehlende Information (S-Wort
bzw. F-Wort) einfuegen.
In Betriebsart 8 oder 9 mit Satznum-
mernwahl hinter den zuletzt abgearbei-
teten Satz aufsetzen und mit "Zyklus
Start" die Bearbeitung fortsetzen.
Fehler 74 Gesperrte Funktionen bei Betrieb mit
Rundschalttisch.
Nicht zugelassen sind G1, G55, G56,
G91
Abhilfemassnahme Programm in Betriebsart 11 korrigie-
ren. Bedienerhandbuch zur Hilfe neh-
men. "Zubehoer-Rundschalttisch"
Fehler 75 Startsatz und/oder Endsatz von Wieder-
holung Lxx fehlt.
Abhilfemassnahme Programm in Betriebsart 11 korrigie-
ren, danach erneut Programmabarbeitung
in BA 8 oder 9 fortsetzen.
Fehler 76 1. Schachtelungstiefe groesser 16.
2. Aufgerufener Unterprogrammsatz
fehlt.
Abhilfemassnahme Programm in BA 11 korrigieren, danach
erneut Programmabarbeitung in BA 8
oder 9 fortsetzen.
Fehler 78 Unbekannte Zeichen oder falsche Werte
erscheinen:
1. Bei Abarbeitung in BA 8 oder 9.
2. Bei Programm-Einlesen in BA 14.
Abhilfemassnahme zu 1. Programm in BA 11 korrigieren.
zu 2. Fehlerhaften Datentraeger (Loch-
streifen, Kassette) ueberpruefen
und ggf. austauschen.
3. NSP55- bzw. NSI56-Baugruppe aus-
tauschen.
Fehler 79 Falsche oder fehlende Checksum (Quer-
summe aller Programmdaten). Das ein-
gelesene Programm bleibt im Speicher
erhalten.
Abhilfemassnahme Fehleranzeige quittieren. Hierzu die
"Uebernahme"-Taste druecken.
Bemerkung Beim Auslesen des Programmes wird die
Checksum von der CNC-Steuerung auto-
matisch generiert.
Fehler 80 Programmierfehler.
Aufstartsatz fehlt (G41/42-G40).
Abhilfemassnahme Programm in BA 11 korrigieren, danach
Programmabarbeitung in BA 8 oder 9
fortsetzen.
Fehler 81 Programmierfehler.
Ebenenkonflikt:
- Kreisebene nicht identisch mit Bahn-
ebene. (bei Kreis zwischen Auf- und
Abstartsatz)
- Kreisebene nicht identisch mit Dreh-
ebene (bei Kreis nach Nullpunktver-
schiebung mit Drehung).
- Polebene nicht identisch mit Bahn-
ebene (Polarkoordinatenangabe in der
Bahn).
- Polebene nicht identisch mit Dreh-
ebene (Polarkoordinateneingabe bei
NPV mit Drehung).
- Bahnebene nicht identisch mit Dreh-
ebene (bei Aufstartsatz nach NPV mit
Drehung).
- Drehebene nicht identisch mit Bahn-
ebene.
Abhilfemassnahme Programm entsprechend korrigieren.
Fehler 82 1. G07/G08 - Satz darf nur zwischen
zwei Bahnsaetzen - G01/G02/G03 ste-
hen.
2. G08-Satz (Fase) darf nur an der
Aussenkontur Gerade-Gerade program-
miert werden. Unzulaessig ist die
Einbindung von G08 an der Aussenkon-
tur zwischen folgenden Elementen:
Kreis-Kreis
Kreis-Gerade
Gerade-Kreis
Abhilfemassnahme Programm in BA 11 korrigieren. Bedie-
nerhandbuch bzw. Kurzbetriebsanlei-
tung zur Hilfe nehmen.
Fehler 83 In der Bahn sind folgende Funktionen
gesperrt.
1. G0, G52, G53, G54, S, V, T, M10,
M11, M20 bis M27.
2. Bewegungen mit mehr als 2 Achsen.
3. C-Achse.
4. G91 nach Abstartsatz (G40).
5. Zu viele Leersaetze/Nichtverfahr-
saetze hintereinander in der Bahn.
Abhilfemassnahme Programm in BA 11 korrigieren.
Fehler 84 Programmierfehler:
1. Auszuraeumende Kontur ist nicht ge-
schlossen.
2. Zu viele Stuetzpunkte zum Ausraeumen
der Kontur noetig.
Abhilfemassnahme zu 1. In BA 11 Programm korrigieren
(Kontur schliessen).
zu 2. Ausraeumen dieser Kontur ist nicht
moeglich.
Fehler 85 Fraeserradius ist zu gross. Abarbeitung
ist gesperrt wegen Gefahr der Konturbe-
schaedigung bei:
1. Kreisinnenseiten, Kreisaussenseiten,
wenn die verbleibende Fraesermittel-
punktsbahn einen Radius ˇ0.01mm hat.
2. Verrundung sofern G60 wirksam ist.
3. Ecken auf der Innenseite, beruehrt
der Fraeser die Bahnelemente nicht mehr
tangential.
Abhilfemassnahme Programm in BA 11 korrigieren.
1. Fraeserradius kleiner waehlen.
2. Entsprechende Konturstelle aendern.


too many characters

After approx. 10 years sitting dormant in my small shop at home I now have my FP3NC running again.

The first error was no communication coming back from the CNC to the PC and the monitor remaining dark. This was a bad or non-compatible NPP55.
This allowed the CNC side to come up, but the machine would not start, even with all Bosch cards removed. I was stumped, but stumbled over a posting by Professor Emeritus Ross C., recommending to fill up the way oil tank.
This I would not have thought of.
Indeed the tank was at minimum, so I filled up. It then threw an FP02, which I could cancel and then it started up!
It does not yet want to shift and it turns the wrong way, that seems trivial. Right now its warming up.
Example of storage oddities: the cabinet fan was running even with door open because the contact switch was stuck in the closed position for so long, it got used to it and would not disengage.

It slept so long I feel like gently waking it.


On edit:
30 min later.
Damn, celebrated too early. Same problem again.

Hey all, got something to throw out there. I have a FP4NC with D4 fliphead and universal table to rehome.

Bear with me on a drawn out explanation or skip this paragraph for specifics on the machine in the next. As my moniker implies I started out with a FP4A with the 2.5 axis grundig control and while that was around 15 yrs ago it should be clear that I am acquainted with poor decision making! I now have an FP4nc with D4 control and an nc rotary table. I had been wanting a universal table for years but couldn't quite accept the associated cost. Then a full machine with said table popped up for 3500 at the notorious HGR reseller in OH. I decided that having 2 deckels with different tables would be fun and worse case I would have a universal table and a bunch of spares. Well when reality set in post purchase I realized I didn't really have the space especially since machining is not my living so I shelved the idea and as with most impulsive questionable decisions, actively ignored. After paying enough in storage to have just shipped the darn thing I finally gave myself an ultimatum, I had decided I would render the machine a donor and have the table and some other bits picked off so it could ship ltl and and as for the carcass... In the meantime a universal table had popped up and a fellow here on the forum had expressed interest in a machine. It gave me thought of getting out from under the machine and just getting a table. It would remain a financial mistake but I wouldn't have the stain of deckel green blood on my hands. Unfortunately after some consideration the potential buyer decided the risk was more than he wanted to take on which I understand. So, here I am wondering if anyone else would want to step in? The machine is complete but has surface rust and staining from a less than ideal long storage. It came from Mahle whom I think of as a piston manufacturer but apparently they make a lot of auto stuff. Anyhow it was claimedly functioning when removed and looks to have been treated with dignity in removal which helps me believe but I am by nature less suspicious than is safe.

In short if someone wants to take on a ? FP4NC Dialog 4 fliphead with universal for $4000,let me know (I am eating the majority of storage as a self punishment). I have paid storage through the month but would like to have this sorted this week. Bit of a hail mary but why not?!

Attached Thumbnails

       

I've decided to open, clean and grease the horizontal spindle of my FP2. Now that I have it out, I need to make a couple of special wrenches. I'd like to use the vertical head on the FP2 to do this, but with the horizontal spindle removed. Does anyone see a problem with that?? I will of course plug the 80mm hole in the front and the 38mm one in the back to keep oil in and dirt out.

As far as I can tell, the transfer gear (which moves power from the headstock/ram up to the vertical spindle) is entirely supported by two 6010 bearings and does not get any support from the horizontal spindle. So having the horizontal spindle out should be no problem.

Anyone ever taken apart the 1960's type manual Maho MH600/700 and looked at the feed motor?
Due to a problem with the main 2 speed spindle motor I'm swapping that out for one driven by a single phase VFD outputting 220v 3 phase.
The feed motor is also two speed 415v 3 phase and is buried right in the guts of the machine. I'm curious if anyone has changed the feed motor as well, or perhaps converted it to run on delta (220v 3 phase) before I start burrowing in. I suspect that it's probably bespoke/integral with some other parts and therefore a problem to swap out. I could run the spindle via single phase & VFD and the feed via 3 phase & rotary converter but that's not very elegant. I'd prefer to replace both and wire it all in neatly.

Charles

Hello, it's my first post here and i hope i'm in the right section.

I recently acquired a Deckel GK21 but it's still missing parts and the electrical part is really weird from what i can see and i would be glad if i had some little help for figuring out this mess.

The first one looks like there's some modules missing but i don't know what's exactly missing

IMG-20201016-180523277 — ImgBB

The second one i just have no idea what the heck it could be,any ideas ?

IMG-20201016-180543412 — ImgBB

Title says it all
I have a realy nice Italian made Comec TGA160S lathe with unreadable gearchart
If I have a decent photo of one I can make a sticker and put that on
A long shot I know

Peter

My first post;
I live in Portugal, looking to buy my first milling machine.
I'm looking mostly on German sites as these things are a lot cheaper there. I've found that shipping an extra 1,000 km makes little difference to the price, the main cost is local pickup + delivery.

So my question;
I see a Ruhla duplex 58 for sale. weight 1550kg
Supposedly identical, a Ruhla FUW 250/710 is 885kg.
I thought it was a typo but images of both data plates are clear.
Googling around, I found other examples of the FUW 250/710. some are listed as 1,300kg, others as 850kg.
These are built at wildly different times, but the weight difference doesn't follow build year at all.
Thiel duplex 159 built in west Germany is supposed to be identical to the east German Ruhla machines, manual from the French site [link found here, thanks] seems to show a hoist loading of 1150 kg

What's with these wildly different weights? I can understand a couple of hundred kilos as years pass and things develop, but as I said, the weight changes don't correspond to build year.
And what's the opinion regarding these machines [the east German ones]?

Thanks,
Mark
In Portugal

I have a nice universal rotary table that I"m too old to move (maybe 500 lbs.). I'll give it to anyone who wants to pick it up here in Los Angeles. It is for an FP4, not FP4M or K. Email me and I'll send a photo if interested. Rich group5engr@aol.com

Hello

I bought a Fp1 yesterday

Serial number 22495 . Anyone knows what year it was made ?

And today noticed I can push the table with leadscrew side to side 1.5mm

Can screw and nut be this worn or do do you think something is loose ?

The part I pointing at also mowes back and forward .

Also the X-dial dosent turns when attaching the locking nut . It just get stucked .
Im sure someone has had this appart .

I dont have any manual or drawings on the mashine yet .

The pictures is turned wrong nomather wath I do ?? Sorry

Thanks Johan from Sweden

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I'm in the process of giving the high speed head some much needed attention, trying to remove the bottom retaining ring on the spindle, unsure if left or right hand thread, but so far very reluctant to move, any advise appreciated.The collet size is 16mm.
Thanks Alan

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Hey y'all,

My FP2 is the external motor version, 400mm X travel, serial #5415. This is 1966 vintage, according to FS.

At some point I noticed that there's a bit of a "clunk" in my Y-axis handwheel sometimes, perhaps when I switch from power feed to hand feed and/or reverse hand feed direction.
On investigation I found there's a bit of endplay on the Y-axis shaft from the handwheel to the bevel gear (I assume that's where it goes). I've been trying to figure out what the bearing arrangement there is like and how to get into it. The parts manual I have doesn't really have a good breakdown of this that I find, though maybe I'm overlooking it - it's happened before :).
I assume there is a pair of thrust bearings there with a nut and a locknut, like e.g. on the X-axis handwheel. I did a search on the forum, but I can't find any good images or descriptions, alas.
Can anyone point me in the right direction?

Siggi

Hi all
I am new to metal working and machining, I have always had a keen interest in machining but never had a Opportunity to give it a go but since COVID lockdowns in Melbourne Australia I have had plenty of time on my hands and have been discovering old used machines which I have been restoring and using which have been an amazing experience when a rusty old unloved machine gets cleaned up and works well.

Now I have come across this Deckel FP1 which is performed my garage due to its very small footprint.. but I don’t know much about milling machines. Unfortunately this machine didn’t come with a motor which isn’t a massive issue because motors are readily available but I don’t know what size motor the machine originally came with so can someone please tell me know what size and speed if on their Deckel?
Also the pulley diameter?

I have attached pictures on the Deckel if anyone could let me know if there is else missing and is there anything else I need to know about this machine?

Thank you in advance .

Can someone let me know how to add pictures?

Evening chaps.
My late model FP1 aktiv has had issues with the DRO since I bought it. It worked initially, then started flashing on each axis screen, now its totally dead. Friend of the family is a Heidenhain engineer, they only support systems for 20 years apparently so he's no help. Franz Singer sells an exchange unit - I'm guessing this is the easiest way to solve my problem?
While I'm ordering from singer I need new bellows for the Z axis. Are the metal "samurai looking" ones a sensible choice while I'm doing it? Do they need any other parts or are they a straight swap?
Thanks in advance!
Tom

I know the LK gets a lot of negative press on here, but I spotted one on facebook marketplace 2 weeks ago (with horrendous pictures and dyslexic write up. My favourite!). For the price I figured even if it turned out to be scrap I'd have a fine boring head, an optical rotary table and a grinding head that could all be used on my FP2. 300 mile round trip and I was back at work for 11am.
Deckel LK jig borer
So far all I've done is get it into the workshop. The bellows all look a bit rough, but it looks like someone took the time to grease some of the surfaces so it may be ok. The seller's father got it in a job lot of machines and didn't know what it was or how to run it so it sat in a corner for years.

20201027_152005
Then I spotted the cabinet in the corner - managed to talk him into selling it. My plan is eventually to fabricate a large cabinet like the FP2 original one that I can keep all the heads and tables in. One day...

centering scope
In amongst all the stuff he'd collected that looked like it was to do with the borer there was a centering scope and a really nice sensitive drilling attachment
sensitive drill
(also one piece of the deckel step riser blocks - no others unfortunately!)

Main goal initially is to get the ways cleaned enough for me to try powering it up and seeing what works. If I'm lucky and it all fires up I'd like to recomission it - not sure how much I'd use it but it's too nice to scrap!

Oke I have this FP3 in stock for some time now Not advertising with it yet as it needed some attention
Sold it anyhow Funtionalyties checked and a DRO installed
I knew it had a feed problem Not the sheerpin Well I ended up removing the lid of the lower gearbox
I did notice though that this was not the first time someone has worked on the machine
I did not notice anything out of the ordinairy So put it back together That is a bit of a pita because all 3 shifters have to be lined up
Well it turned out that twas the problem in the first place Shifters not lined up

Oke So far so good
Now we checked the speeds WTH the same problem
Oke We took of the lid and ligned up the shifters Not good
Second time No good eighter So after 5 attempts I noticed that when turning the spindle by hand I had some decent drag although the gears were out of mesh
Mmmmmm
Looked it over Checked it once more And a third time Nothing
But finaly I noticed the problem
The set of 3 gears the middle one turned freely
item 200130417 in the drawing



It looked like a key was sheared of
Well that involves some work :Yawn:
Taking the thing out is not that difficult
Remove both covers on the front and back of the machine





Gently tap out the shaft from the front and take out the gears
There it is


More to come
Peter

I'm looking for my first mill and have decided on a horizontal/vertical machine with a ram. I found a K&T 205 with a dealer in Ohio. Unfortunately, there's no way for me to inspect the machine prior to purchase. The dealer has recorded two videos of the machine. If anyone has a few minutes to take a look at provide some feedback, I'd really appreciate it. I'm picking up an odd noise from the vertical head, but I'm not sure what's typical on a machine like this.

Dealer listing:
Kearney & Trecker - Horizontal Mill With | Industrial Assets Machinery

Machine videos:
Kearney & Trecker - Horizontal Mill With Vertical Independent Overarm | 12" x 56"Stock #6595P - YouTube
Kearney & Trecker - Horizontal Mill W/ Vertical Independant Motorized Overarm- 12" x 56" Stock#6595P - YouTube

Thanks!!

horizontal overarm setup of Schaublin 53



Schaublin 53, taillage d'engrenage 1ere partie - YouTube

Hello,

does someone have the circuit diagrams of the SPS cards of the Deckel FP machines with Dialog 11 control? Partly can found on the Internet, but unfortunately not from the cards themselves. Would be nice if someone could send them to me.

Thanks!

I bought this from PM member pops in 2010, there is previous discussion of it here. Pops bought it new. I parked it in storage not long after buying it, now I'm taking stock of the possible future and in the mood to sell.

It was in complete good running condition when purchased. Don Sentner inspected it before I bought it and declared it to meet OEM geometry specs. It has 125K memory expansion, 3D interpolation, on screen graphics, I started to clean it up and fix a few things like way wipers, and contracted a case of "while we're at it" OCD. The upper gearbox didn't disengage smoothly when the head was flipped, and the Y axis could have used some scraping and flaking, so it came apart.
While looking for a Deckel toolmaker universal table I was offered a FP7NC with a tilt/rotary table, and bought it. We moved the FP4NC out into storage "temporarily" to get the FP7NC in the shop, intending to get back to the FP4NC to finish it for my personal shop. Well, 9 years later, it's still apart and the 7 fulfills my needs for a toolroom mill. Time to sell to make room and time for other things.

In the meantime I've accumulated a few things for it. I have a complete extra 3M control from a low hours FP3NC. I saved everything from that machine that could possibly be used on the FP4NC like the spindle and servo motors, hydraulic and lube pumps, the hand pendants, plus more like the complete Y axis w/transmission and spindle, and the glass scales. Also have still more extra 3M boards and control cage. And more I've forgotten I'm certain. Bring a big trailer.

I have a tilt/rotary universal table from a MAHO MH700P I intended to mount on it. It is slightly bigger than the Deckel table, more the size of the fixed table. It does not have an encoder, It does have hydraulic clamping for rigidity. It has a dividing head plate attachment. So you can't use a digital position readout with this table. On the other hand you don't need the extra electronics to use it accurately. Plus it cranks in and out with the handle on the front, so it will swing larger parts when needed.

I also have a NOS overarm support for an unknown MAHO I intended to adapt to the Deckel, because the Deckel supports were only installed at the factory. Started on the prints for that before the machine was parked.

I have a couple horizontal arbors, some pull studs in imperial and metric, I have all the manuals and the orange book, etc.

Price for the machine, all the spares, and the Maho table, $6500. Without the table, $5000. I'll sell the table alone for $1800 if the machine buyer doesn't want it. I don't want to sell any Deckel parts before the machine is sold.

I also have a slotter head that will be available AFTER the machine sells.

I'm pretty sure I'll regret selling in a few years, so the prices are firm.

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